tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post6726084056572201488..comments2023-10-19T10:34:33.030-05:00Comments on Praisegod Barebones: Bravo to the GCR Task ForceBart Barberhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comBlogger34125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-83753316090151123992010-03-07T16:51:27.684-06:002010-03-07T16:51:27.684-06:00What questions would you ask the GCRTF directly? I...What questions would you ask the GCRTF directly? I'd like to hear from you. I am hosting our next "Audio COnference for Pastors" with members of the GCRTF. See questions already proposed and discussion already started from leaders that see things very differently that most of this group. Many are from New Work areas where it appears funding will be eliminated. There also appears to bobby gilstraphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09729558075870244139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-68579663576603462422010-02-25T19:56:08.652-06:002010-02-25T19:56:08.652-06:00Bart,
I tend agree with the critics of the IMB on...Bart,<br /><br />I tend agree with the critics of the IMB on north american soil. If allowed at all the percentage should be very small. If we are now saying that NAMB can fully fund and send missionaries it almost seems unnecessary for the imb to work on north american soil except for very specific strategic reasons. After all, Namb could hire their own experts to target a people group...evenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-83829279394092317322010-02-25T15:41:06.605-06:002010-02-25T15:41:06.605-06:00We know how to grow a church--lots of research don...We know how to grow a church--lots of research done on that.<br /><br />What we desperately need to learn is how to grow a group of churches--an Association, a State Convention or a Denomination.<br /><br />One starting place is to look for what Heath and Heath (Switch: How to Change Things When Change is Hard.) calls "bright spots". What the authors of Influencers call "positive Josh Hunthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03369534139126012282noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-47499449649765393852010-02-24T21:39:37.633-06:002010-02-24T21:39:37.633-06:00I only pray that we will pray for the GCR Task For...I only pray that we will pray for the GCR Task Force much more than we critique their work before they are even finished.Ron Evansnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-83855823417714574342010-02-24T18:29:31.384-06:002010-02-24T18:29:31.384-06:00Bart,
What if I told you my wife is a central asi...Bart,<br /><br />What if I told you my wife is a central asian, mbb, and that there are other like her who could easily minister to close culture immigrants (ME-1, ME-2 evangelism). I think your arguments in a minute way display the great white hope ideology. We have thousands of ethnic believers living in the US. (Also, if the imb were to be involved, perhaps it would be better in sending Zhanara and Wesleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10217998543316791993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-6351140658364571082010-02-24T17:35:23.490-06:002010-02-24T17:35:23.490-06:00Thanks, Wes. I, too, enjoy the conversation (which...Thanks, Wes. I, too, enjoy the conversation (which is why I do this!)<br /><br />I know that we've engaged in several volleys here, and I want to make sure that you know this much: This is not one of those topics that gets my blood pressure up. I think we're having a good conversation here, and I appreciate your sharing of your point of view.<br /><br />Now, as to the role of the IMB Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-84194819203022030062010-02-24T16:56:01.187-06:002010-02-24T16:56:01.187-06:00Bart,
(before I keep going I want you to know how...Bart,<br /><br />(before I keep going I want you to know how much I appreciate the dialogue!)<br /><br />Why should we have to?<br /><br />Furthermore, Is that the role of imb? If NAMB is gonna be strategizing in the cities, wouldn't having imb involved cause confusion?<br /><br />Going through imb adds a costly and confusing middle man in the process.<br /><br />Plus, would it real Zhanara and Wesleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10217998543316791993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-70470313187438736722010-02-24T16:32:52.515-06:002010-02-24T16:32:52.515-06:00Wes,
I certainly know of no reason why your churc...Wes,<br /><br />I certainly know of no reason why your church or mine shouldn't go to Boston (although we've chosen to go to the other end of Massachusetts instead). I just also don't know of any good reason why your church or mine shouldn't go to Boston through our partnership through the International Mission Board.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-42943682006192856182010-02-24T16:18:33.386-06:002010-02-24T16:18:33.386-06:00Bart,
Why wouldn't your church, or mine, or a...Bart,<br /><br />Why wouldn't your church, or mine, or any other SBC church go to Boston?<br /><br />BTW, we have a couple from our church who are now serving at a Russian speaking congregation in Boston. I'm glad they were able to make it up there rather quickly without having to go through the whole imb process!<br /><br />WesZhanara and Wesleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10217998543316791993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-63268161435959710462010-02-24T16:14:19.101-06:002010-02-24T16:14:19.101-06:00Dan,
If I understand the report correctly, I woul...Dan,<br /><br />If I understand the report correctly, I would instead predict this:<br /><br />-Church planters in the state would cease to receive funding from the state convention and would instead wind up working directly for NAMB as direct missionaries.<br />- Coordinating staff for church planting would cease to work for the state convention and would work at one of the 7 regional NAMB Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-88924743917882896482010-02-24T16:07:08.509-06:002010-02-24T16:07:08.509-06:00Wes,
You make some good points. I am in favor of ...Wes,<br /><br />You make some good points. I am in favor of our churches directly planting churches, and I see the contrast that you are indicating between the NAMB recommendation and the IMB recommendation.<br /><br />I should hope that the IMB, busy as they are, will not be wasting time planting churches among groups where the local churches are already sufficiently at work. IOW, if the IMB is Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-33928768792731506252010-02-24T15:59:35.525-06:002010-02-24T15:59:35.525-06:00Katie,
You make a good point. I think we ought to...Katie,<br /><br />You make a good point. I think we ought to be able to agree that internationals residing within the USA are something of a <i>tertium quid</i>. You rightly note that expatriates are not precisely the same as their countrymen at home. Neither are they precisely the same as others being reached here in the USA.<br /><br />You make a good point that IMB may have to overcome Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-59262777103200349882010-02-24T15:42:50.925-06:002010-02-24T15:42:50.925-06:00Bart,
Thanks for your response. What you say mak...Bart,<br /><br />Thanks for your response. What you say makes sense. But the 4-year transition must be very, very well done in my state to avoid some serious turmoil. I just went through our current state budget and discovered that if NAMB funding were to be cut off today, the following would likely happen:<br /><br />-All of the church planters in the state would lose funding.<br />-All of Dannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-80047643435694193162010-02-24T13:57:33.390-06:002010-02-24T13:57:33.390-06:00One thing I forgot to mention, but that is importa...One thing I forgot to mention, but that is important, we have to realize that in North America, the people that is becoming more and more unreached are not the internationals and immigrants--its the natives!<br /><br />WesZhanara and Wesleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10217998543316791993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-46324489309400445372010-02-24T13:53:36.522-06:002010-02-24T13:53:36.522-06:00Dr. Barber,
I have to agree with our overseas per...Dr. Barber,<br /><br />I have to agree with our overseas personnel friend Katie.<br /><br />People from other countries living permanently in the US progressively and quickly become less and less like their friends, family and culture overseas. I have an international marriage, I routinely interact with internationals, I'm a student of missiology and cultural anthropology. As such, I think I Zhanara and Wesleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10217998543316791993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-15209223445274596812010-02-24T13:09:37.285-06:002010-02-24T13:09:37.285-06:00Current Mission: It is the purpose of the Conventi...<i>Current Mission: It is the purpose of the Convention to provide a general organization for Baptists in the United States and its territories ...</i><br /><br />Proposed Mission: As a convention of churches, ...<br /><br /><br /><i>Current Mission: ... for the promotion of Christian missions at home and abroad ...</i><br /><br />Proposed Mission: ... our missional vision is to present the bapticus hereticushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04526321800594075557noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-28254351668527998152010-02-24T12:43:19.244-06:002010-02-24T12:43:19.244-06:00Hi Bart,
Overall, like you, I’m very encouraged ...Hi Bart, <br /><br />Overall, like you, I’m very encouraged by what the GCR Task Force has presented and think I can get fully behind it. I hope this will capture the hearts and minds of our churches and make a great impact starting with individual believers and local churches in a renewed commitment to the Great Commission. <br /><br />However, as an IMB missionary, I’m a little disappointed to Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-83918086379838707322010-02-24T12:39:46.788-06:002010-02-24T12:39:46.788-06:00Thanks, Joe. Maybe somebody will make a motion to ...Thanks, Joe. Maybe somebody will make a motion to amend. I would vote in favor of that.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-24237144194665216512010-02-24T12:37:38.035-06:002010-02-24T12:37:38.035-06:00Dan,
Of course, I say all that I said above witho...Dan,<br /><br />Of course, I say all that I said above without the foggiest clue which state convention we have in mind (nor do I need nor want to know). I am merely articulating what I think are some principles in-play in the making of these decisions.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-26341581516401205542010-02-24T12:36:51.120-06:002010-02-24T12:36:51.120-06:00Dan,
I predict that the end result of this will b...Dan,<br /><br />I predict that the end result of this will be more CP money going to pioneer areas, but less of it into your state convention apparatus. Will this be good or bad for state conventions? I think that it may very well depend upon whether we are looking at the short-term health of state conventions or the long-term health of state conventions.<br /><br />If your state convention Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-66612123127255584982010-02-24T12:21:23.686-06:002010-02-24T12:21:23.686-06:00Dave,
The entire presentation is "official&q...Dave,<br /><br />The entire presentation is "official" in its capacity as a progress report. I do not think that the actual motions to come before the convention even exist yet. Sources tell me that the task force is developing a very detailed book outlining specific directives to accompany each step. Of course, the only things that will have active force will be that which we approve Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-45544867043314457272010-02-24T12:18:07.965-06:002010-02-24T12:18:07.965-06:00Louis,
As someone who has, in the past, had the p...Louis,<br /><br />As someone who has, in the past, had the privilege of teaching Southern Baptist seminarians, I am confident that God continues to provide us with capable leadership for pursuing the Great Commission. Of those men, I can say that nobody "knows" them...yet.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-1914586720041904452010-02-24T12:16:57.724-06:002010-02-24T12:16:57.724-06:00Thank you for your readership and interaction, Dr....Thank you for your readership and interaction, Dr. Kear.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-36612899389928256692010-02-24T12:15:37.282-06:002010-02-24T12:15:37.282-06:00David,
By all means, let's look over the reco...David,<br /><br />By all means, let's look over the recommendations carefully. As I have demonstrated in this post, I have questions about some of the items, too. None of them successfully sap away from my overall enthusiasm for the report.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5643342666676162215.post-50959281626941251282010-02-24T12:14:31.225-06:002010-02-24T12:14:31.225-06:00Matt,
I'm hopeful that many people across our...Matt,<br /><br />I'm hopeful that many people across our convention will agree with the both of us.Bart Barberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14021102240441576393noreply@blogger.com